Clancy Brown Fan Club Weblog

Saturday, March 12, 2005

WIRX “Decoding Carnivale” call-in with Clancy Brown • 02-28-05

This is the transcript from Clancy’s radio call-in segment on Southwest Michigan’s WIRX/Rock 107.1, with Shelley Morgan.

SHELLEY: It’s Monday, which means it’s after Sunday, and even though there was lots of Oscar action going on last night, there was “Carnivale,” as well. So it’s time to Decode Carnivale with Brother Justin Crowe on the show, known on this side of the TV screen as Clancy Brown. Something else cool going on over the weekend, and even through tonight online… It’s called CarnyCon. It’s an online “Carnivale” convention, complete with chats with some of the show’s stars. In fact, last night Clancy Brown was chatting after “Carnivale” aired on the east coast. Tonight, you can chat with “Carnivale” creator, Dan Knauf, and poke around the inside of his head! Which seems to be a very scary place… You can check it out online at Or if you just go to, we’ll link you there. There’s a really cool Online Auction site, as well, proceeds going to the Beth Brown Memorial Fund.
Now before we get down to business with last night’s show and “Decoding Carnivale”, Clancy, tell me about the Beth Brown Memorial Fund.

CLANCY: The Beth Brown Memorial Fund is named after my older sister who died when she was seven of childhood leukemia. I was about five and, back then, and it was just not… It wasn’t a pleasant thing to go through. And now that I have kids, I realize how horrible it was, especially for my parents. But what they did was, rather than champion leukemia research and all the rest of that, which was going on and still happens, and is a very healthy charity, they wanted to do something a little more specific to Beth. And Beth wanted to be a nurse, so they started a fund to give modest scholarships to young ladies, at the time, who wanted to be nurses. And it’s since grown, and we do modest scholarships to people who want to have careers in healthcare. I think that there’s actually a heart surgeon who got a couple hundred bucks from the Beth Brown Memorial Fund. But it’s been a very quiet and private charity for a lot of years, funded mostly by my folks. And now that I’m getting at least some kind of notoriety, I’m trying to turn that attention into that, so they can give more money to more people, and been a little more aggressive about raising funds through things like this auction and giving money myself. But it’s worthwhile. It’s a neat little alumni association – everybody from your local nurse to a heart surgeon has been touched by this charity in a modest way. And it’s worthwhile, I think. And it’s not… We don’t spend any money on paying any officers or promotion or anything like that. So, ALL the money goes toward endowing these scholarships. And so I’m immensely grateful to anybody who wants to even acknowledge it. So, if anybody wants to send us a buck or two, you have my undying gratitude.

Shelley: So, if you’re interested in the Beth Brown Memorial Fund, you can go to , We will definitely link you to where you can find out more. Okay!
So, that being said… Let us “Decode Carnivale.” And last night at CarnyCon, during last night’s chat, one of the questions from one of the folks online was about you character, Brother Justin Crowe, being Sofie’s father! Which I… I must admit, I missed somewhere in the show!

Clancy: I… I think you can presume that Justin raped Apollonia.

Shelley: Okay.

Clancy: I don’t think we know the details of it, and I don’t think, actually, we ever will know the details of it. I’ve even asked that question. And I’ve gotten kind of a general answer. But we did see, in season one, when we saw Apollonia being raped, we saw…

Shelley: The Tattoo…

Clancy: And we saw another person without a tattoo, with his shirt on – Thank God! And that was me!

Shelley: Okay.

Clancy: And I think it’s pretty clear, although there’s cuts and stuff amongst it, it’s very clear that there’s two beings doing the same act. And one is a manifestation of the future, of destiny, of the nature of Justin… And one is definitely Justin. I think I can say that safely…

Shelley: Without getting into too much trouble! At the end of the show last night, it showed… it was one of those “Wow, I should have seen that coming!” moments, again. Sofie, the new maid in the Crowe household! How ‘bout that?!?

Clancy: Well, yeah! And because the story is unfolding so fast now, because everybody was complaining about last season and the first part of this season, you have a lot of people now saying, “Oh, I knew it! I saw it coming a mile away!” Well, ya know what? It wasn’t a mile away. It was like two episodes ago, okay? If you saw it a mile away, then you saw it in the middle of last season which, of course, nobody saw. Now, some people like to be fooled, some people like to be surprised, and some people don’t want to see the magic trick, don’t want to see how it ends. And some people, as soon as they see how it’s done say, “Oh, I knew it!” (Laughing) Like, okay… whatever! It is what it is. It’s a magic trick. You’re supposed to enjoy it.

Shelley: And I did enjoy it!

Clancy: (laughing) Good!

Shelley: I was like, “Oh, that TOTALLY makes sense! This is gonna be fun!”

Clancy: Right, because the payoff ultimately isn’t what happens, it’s sort of how you get there.

Shelley: Exactly.

Clancy: Sort of the grades of subtlety of how it’s accomplished.

Shelley: Life is a journey, not a destination.

Clancy: There ya go! (chuckling)

Shelley: Hey, let’s go back to the beginning of the show. On “Carnivale” last night it picked up where last week’s episode left off, I mean right there. Management, or Belyakov, dead on the floor of the trailer, blue blood oozing from his body, and then drawing up into the knife that Ben must use to kill Justin. Blue blood – Avatar blood!

Clancy: We’ve seen blue blood before, and we know that it is significant, that there is a point at which these Avatars… Their blood turns blue, for some reason. (chuckling) You know… We know when it happens now. We know that somebody has to die. We know that it comes with enlightenment, that’s one of the prices of enlightenment. So, it’s safe to assume now that Ben probably has blue blood.

Shelley: One would think!

Clancy: And Justin probably DOESN’T yet, but he might soon!

Shelley: He’s gotta be getting close to it. If he kills Scudder, then he would get the blue blood.

Clancy: Right. That’s right. And that’s a logical conclusion to come to, as well.

Shelley: And now that Management is dead, Ben receives all of Management’s knowledge and power and enlightenment, basically.

Clancy: Ben knows everything. But not everybody believes him, or not the important people. Samson doesn’t believe him yet.

Shelley: Ya know, I think Samson’s on his way, though, because of the accident on Colossus…

Clancy: Absolutely right.

Shelley: Where he was the only one who saw what was going on between Ben and the mother and the son.

Clancy: Right.

Shelley: He stood there and watched, and then later on with the trailer… Ben manifests this trailer for Samson to go take a look at, and instead of being able to bring Belyakov back, he could bring some of his things back, so that Samson could kind of say goodbye.

Clancy: Right.

Shelley: Samson doesn’t believe fully, but he’s on his way.

Clancy: Yes… I think by the end of this show he believes fully. I think when you see someone actually do what Ben did, and he can manifest a trip down Memory Lane for Samson, then I think Samson’s won over. And I think in the next few episodes, you see Ben slowly convince everyone.

Shelley: Oh, really?

Clancy: Transform everyone in the Carnivale to be his advocates.

Shelley: Really?!?

Clancy: Well, at least the essential folks, you know? Eventually, everyone becomes convinced to be his disciple, and to follow him into battle. But that’s gonna be a theme ongoing, turning people into believers.

Shelley: Duh, that makes sense. I’m sorry… I’m sitting here feeling like a dumbass, because he would need to do that, because Justin’s been doing that.

Clancy: And Justin has… What Justin has that Ben doesn’t have is an army of believers. He has thousands… I mean, did he mention the numbers tonight?

Shelley: There was seventeen thousand people that were at New Canaan.

Clancy: Right, he has seventeen thousand believers that will do what he thinks is the right thing to do.

Shelley: Right.

Clancy: You know, that’s not good odds, one in seventeen thousand. So maybe it’s a little better if there’s, ya know, seven or eight or ten against seventeen thousand. (chuckling)

Shelley: A little bit better.

Clancy: A little better.

Shelley: Not much, but a little. It’s somethin’!

Clancy: (chuckling) It’s somethin’, anyway…

Shelley: (giggling) Ben needs all the help he can get. Now, after the show last night, you were online at CarnyCon, the show’s online convention. Doing what?

Clancy: That’s right. And I was Servicing the Faithful, that’s what I like to think… (evil chuckle)

Shelley: Yeah, that’s what it is! I think that’s what we’re gonna start calling Justin’s little dalliances with the maids – “Servicing the Faithful.”

Clancy: (chuckling) Servicing the Faithful! That’s excellent! Excellent!

Shelley: I love that!

Clancy: And here’s a little something about that, as well… Those are not rapes, by any means.

Shelley: No!

Clancy: Okay? And I’m not just protecting Justin here…

Shelley: No, they’re not! The women come to him willingly!

Clancy: Indeed. But if they’re rapes, it diminishes the one rape that we knew that happened. And that one, THAT one, has to stand above anything. THAT is the rape that occurs in this show, and that is… That’s a horrible, terrible event for SO many reasons…

Shelley: Um-hmm.

Clancy: So, any of the other things that happen…? Those aren’t rapes. They’re rough, and they may be more than anyone expected, but they’re not rapes.

Shelley: I never had that impression – ever.

Clancy: Okay, good.

Shelley: I never did. The women come to him… C’mon! He’s an incredibly powerful figure. Women are attracted to power. They come to him willingly, whether he’s a man of the cloth or not.

Clancy: Atta-girl! Thank you, Shell… (chuckling)

Shelley: You’re welcome. I have to stand up for you!

Clancy: (chuckling) Thank you!

Shelley: Because some people just don’t get it!

Clancy: That’s right… Hate me for everything else! But don’t hate me for that.

Shelley: Okay, now that we’ve explained that part of the show… how ‘bout Jonesy and Libby?

Clancy: Whoo-hoo!

Shelley: It’s like, oh no… They’re gonna get married.

Clancy: Of course!

Shelley: Oh, boy!

Clancy: Of course! What else are they gonna do?

Shelley: I know…

Clancy: I mean, that’s just what people do! (chuckling)

Shelley: Get drunk and get married. But it was great! It was… Libby finally standing up and saying, “Ya know what? You don’t own me, and YOU don’t own me! I’m gonna do what I wanna do, and you all just have to deal with it.”

Clancy: It definitely means a lot more to her than it does to Jones. I mean, it means a lot to Jones, but it MIGHT have saved her life. And it might kill her, at the same time. So, yeah… It was a relief, but… You know, she’s out of the frying pan and into the fire.

Shelley: Mm-hmm. Which isn’t a surprise, cuz it’s “Carnivale.” So, a Stroud update, he’s got Scudder tied up in the back of his car, he’s on his way to meet up with Brother Justin, he stops for gas, hits the john, walks out of the bathroom into a Bonnie & Clyde kinda holdup – with the Bonnie & Clyde look-alikes in a convertible, ripping off the gas pump jockey. Stroud isn’t having any of it, and he shoots ‘em!

Clancy: Cuz for a second you think, “Oh, wow! Stroud’s doing the right thing!” But really, his motive is he wants the convertible!

Shelley: And can you blame him?

Clancy: (chuckling) Yeah!

Shelley: Cuz he’s driving around in the Dodge that still smells like the Dailey Brothers.

Clancy: Exactly.

Shelley: You gotta get aired out!

Clancy: And why not use a nice new convertible? Although somebody did point out to me that those cars and stuff – I sure had no knowledge of this thing – that that model of convertible is significantly less powerful than the sedan that he was in. To which I kinda said, “Ya know, it really doesn’t matter, cuz it’s a convertible!”

Shelley: Exactly!

Clancy: (laughing)

Shelley: C’mon, there are four cylinder Miatas, for cryin’ out loud! It’s a convertible!

Clancy: That’s right. It’s a convertible. There’s peddle-pusher Miatas and it doesn’t matter!

Shelley: Exactly.

Clancy: The guy with the convertible gets the chicks. That’s all that matters.

Shelley: Exactly! “Carnivale” moves to 10:00 pm this Sunday night on HBO. So, you’ll turn it on at nine, watch a brand new “Deadwood”, followed by a brand new “Carnivale”. Check out CarnyCon online tonight! And actually, I guess, through the end of the week, at, or just go to We’ll definitely link you there! Clancy thanks again for taking the time to spend with us.

Clancy: Good! I’ll seeya later.

Shelley: Good to talk to ya!

Clancy: Thanks!

Shelley: Bye…